"Of Maeglin" Discussion Post

[independence1776]

Of Maeglin

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Summary

Two hundred years after Turgon moved his people to Gondolin, his sister Aredhel grows weary of the confinement and wishes to travel freely again. Turgon eventually acquiesces to her desire and sends three men with her as escort, hoping that they will prevail upon her to travel to Fingon. However, she wishes to visit her friends, the sons of Fëanor. The march-wardens of Doriath will not let her pass and they tell her directions that take her through dangerous routes. She becomes separated from her escort and they return to Gondolin without finding her.

Unable to find her escort, she continues on her way to Celegorm’s lands, where she stays to wait for his return from visiting Caranthir. But she grows restless with the wait and departs again. Riding alone, she becomes ensnared in Nan Elmoth. Eöl lives there, shunning the Noldor and befriending the Dwarves. He is a metalsmith and devises galvorn, a black metal which resists all blades and darts. He sees her wandering and sets spells among the trees so Aredhel is unable to find her way out, but instead draws near to Eöl’s dwelling. He welcomes her and takes her to wife.

She is not wholly unwilling or unhappy in the beginning, despite the restrictions against wandering in sunlight or seeking any of the Noldor. She eventually bears him a son, whom she secretly names Lómion. Eöl names him Maeglin when he is twelve. He physically resembles the Noldor, but in mind resembles his father. He sometimes travels with Eöl to the Dwarven cities, but often spends time with his mother and hears her tales of Eldamar and the House of Fingolfin. This awakens a desire to see Gondolin again and Maeglin to speak with the Fëanorians. Eöl forbids him, naming the Kinslaying as reason, and threatens Maeglin with bonds if he ever tries to seek his Noldorin relatives. This causes a breach in the trust between father and son.

When Eöl is attending a midsummer feast in Nogrod, Eöl persuades his mother to leave Nan Elmoth and travel to Gondolin. They tell the servants that they are traveling to see the sons of Fëanor. When Eöl returns two days later, he follows them, filled with wrath. Curufin, his scouts having noticed Aredhel and Maeglin crossing the Fords of Aros, is camping near the Fords. He has words with Eöl and warns him that if he pursues his wife and son that he will not return to Nan Elmoth.

Eöl follows their path, though they don’t know it, and are betrayed by their abandoned horses. He spies the way to Gondolin. Aredhel and Maeglin are received with honor and joy. Eöl is captured by the border guards and a message is sent to Turgon. Aredhel confirms that he is her husband and asks Turgon not to slay him. Turgon welcomes him as a kinsman, but Eöl replies that the Noldor have stolen Telerin lands and that he demands his wife and son back, although Aredhel can remain if Turgon has a claim to her. Turgon replies that Eöl and his son can either live in Gondolin or die there, but never leave.

Eöl throws a javelin at Maeglin, claiming that he takes the second choice for both. Aredhel leaps in front of it, taking it in her shoulder. Eöl is led away in chains. The wound seems to be small, but Aredhel sickens and dies of poison later that night. Eöl is sentenced to death and is thrown over the Caragdûr, a black precipice upon the north side of the city. His last words are to Maeglin, where he wishes the same death upon him.

Idril remains troubled by this event and never fully trusts Maeglin, who prospers and wins great acclaim among the Gondolindrim. He gathers like-minded people to his side, where they become miners. He finds creates strong weapons for them, which serve them well later. He becomes a trusted counselor and fights at Turgon’s side in the Nirneath Arneodiad. However, he remains secretly unhappy because he is in love with Idril, who is too close of a relation for marriage and does not return his love either way. Over time, Maeglin's unrequited love turns to darkness. He more and more lusts for power. Thus a seed of evil was born in the glory days of Gondolin.


Our Favorite Quotes

~ “I am your sister and not your servant, and beyond yours bounds I will go as seems good to me. And if you begrudge me an escort, then I will go alone.”

~ “But Aredhel, having sought in vain for her companions, rode on, for she was fearless and hardy of heart, as were all the children of Finwë; and she held on her way, and crossing Esgalduin and Aros came to the land of Himlad between Aros and Celon where Celegorm and Curufin dwelt in those days.”

~ “In that wood in ages past Melian walked in the twilight of Middle-earth when the trees were young, and enchantment lay upon it still. But now the trees of Nan Elmoth were the tallest and darkest in all Beleriand, and there the sun never came; and there Eöl dwelt, who was named the Dark Elf. Of old he was of the kin of Thingol, but her was restless and ill at ease in Doriath, and when the Girdle of Melian was set about the Forest of Region where he dwelt he fled thence to Nan Elmoth. There he lived in deep shadow, loving the night and the twilight under the stars.”

~ “There [Eöl] learned much of metalwork, and came to great skill therein; and he devised a metal as hard as the steel of Dwarves, but so malleable that he could make it thin and supple; and yet it remained resistant to all blades and darts. He named it galvorn, for it was black and shining like jet, and he was clad in it whenever he went abroad.”

~ “In the telling of these tales there was awakened in Aredhel a desire to see her own kin again, and she marveled she that she had grown weary of the light of Gondolin, and the fountains in the sun, and the green sward of Tumladen under the windy skies of spring; moreover she was often alone in the shadows when both her son and her husband were away.”

~ “Lady, let us depart while there is still time! What hope is there in this wood for you or for me? Here we are held in bondage, and no profit shall I find here; for I have learned all that my father has to teach, or that the Naugrim will reveal to me. Shall we not seek for Gondolin? You shall be my guide, and I will be your guard!”

~ “'What errand have you, Dark Elf, in my lands? An urgent matter, perhaps, that keeps one so sun-shy abroad by day.'”

~ “Then Curufin laughed at Eöl, and he said: 'They might have found their welcome here less warm than they hoped, had you accompanied them; but it is no matter, for that was not their errand. It is not two days since they passed over the Arossiach, and thence rode swiftly westward. It seems that you would deveive me; unless indeed you yourself have been deceived.'”

~ “’Do not flaunt the title of your wife before me,’ [Curufin] said. ‘For those who steal the daughters of the Noldor and wed them without gift or leave do not gain kinship with their kin.’”

~ “’I acknowledge not your law,’ [Eöl] said. ‘No right have you or any of your kin in this land to seize realms or set bounds, either here or there. This is the land of the Teleri, to which you bring war and all unquiet, dealing ever proudly and unjustly.’”

~ “So you forsake your father and his kin, ill-gotten son! Here shall you fail of all your hopes, and here you may yet die the same death as I.”

~ “Wise in counsel was Maeglin and wary, and yet hardy and valiant at need.”

~ “And however that might be, Idril loved Maeglin not at all; and knowing his thought of her she loved him the less. For it seemed to her a thing strange and crooked in him, as indeed the Eldar ever since have deemed it: an evil fruit of the Kinslaying, whereby the shadow of the curse of Mandos fell upon the last hope of the Noldor.”

~ “Thus it was in Gondolin; and amid all the bliss of that realm, while its glory lasted, a dark seed of evil was sown.”


Alternate Versions

~ In the earliest versions, the events of this chapter – including the founding of Gondolin! - all take place after the Battle of Unnumbered Tears. (1; 2; 3; 4; 5)

~ Maeglin (then called Meglin) makes his first appearance in “The Fall of Gondolin” in the Book of Lost Tales. His father, although already named Eöl, is then a Gnome (= Noldo) and a friend of the Sons of Fëanor, “to whom he is akin”. It is not clear whether Meglin's mother Isfin (Aredhel's name at the time) and Eöl met in Gondolin or elsewhere, or why they have a son considering that Isfin is said to “loathe” Eöl, who “admired her from afar”. (1)

~ The Book of Lost Tales describes Maeglin as less fair than the other Gondolindrim, swart and ill-tempered. Rumour in Gondolin even has it that Maeglin has Orc's blood in him, although Littleheart, the narrator of “The Fall of Gondolin”, cautions that “[he does] not know how this could be true”. However, Maeglin nonetheless has many followers, being the leader of one of the great houses of Gondolin. Although Maeglin is Turgon's nephew from the start, their closeness of kin isn't given as the reason why Turgon forbids marriage between Maeglin and Idril. Instead, the reasons given are that Turgon finds Idril “very loth” to Maeglin's suit, and moreover suspects that Maeglin is more in love with the status he would achieve as Idril's husband than with Idril herself. (2)

~ “The Lay of the Fall of Gondolin” first presents Isfin's ensnarement in Nan Elmoth, where Eöl catches her while she is searching for Fingolfin (who in this version fell in the Nirnaeth). In this version, she is unhappy with her fate from the beginning: “she weepeth in the gloam”. She never leaves her new home, but sends her son Meglin to Gondolin, where he is received with high honour “as the latest seed of Fingolfin”. Eöl no longer appears to be a Gnome, although it is not explicitly said what Elven people he belongs to. (3)

~ In “The earliest 'Silmarillion'” and “The Quenta”, Isfin got lost in the forest of Taurna-fuin after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad for unknown reasons (the idea that she was trying to find her father was abandoned when Fingon, rather than Fingolfin, became the Elven king killed in that battle). “The Quenta” adds the information that Eöl had deserted the hosts of the Eldar before the Nirnaeth, though at least he had not fought on Morgoth's side. Maeglin is later sent to Gondolin; if Eöl disapproves, this is never mentioned. (4; 5)

~ Annal 171 of “The Earliest Annals of Beleriand” reports that Isfin strays out of Gondolin and is taken to wife by Eöl, now explicitly “a Dark-elf”. No further details are given. For the first time, this happens (one year) before the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. (6)

~ “The Earliest Annals” maintain the version where Aredhel never leaves Eöl or Nan Elmoth again. Maeglin is still sent to Gondolin alone, where Turgon welcomes him as his sister's child in 192. (6)

~ “The Later Annals of Beleriand” is much the same as "The Earliest Annals," though it's made explicit that Aredhel sent Maeglin to Gondolin alone, reverting back to even earlier versions. (7) The “Quenta Silmarillion” has no mention of this story, though it is mentioned that Maeglin has dealing with the Dwarves. (8)

~ The information found in “The Grey Annals” is merely a summary of a longer version of the tale, though much new information enters from it. Among it is that Aredhel departed Gondolin against the advice of her brother, her separation from her escort, and the ending of the tale. Maeglin is named for the metal Eöl invented. (9) Annal 273 is rejected to due relying on the older version of the story. (10)

~ The longer version mentioned above was written in 1951 and was heavily edited in about 1970, in both a typed and a carbon copy. These latter versions are the source of the Silmarillion material. (However, it was not intended to be included in the Silmarillion proper, but as part of the longer narrative Of Tuor and the Fall of Gondolin.) Among the changes are Aredhel receiving her name as Isfin no longer fit grammatically or stylistically (11, §1), galvorn receiving its final name (11, §9), and more detail in the narrative about Aredhel and Maeglin’s escape (11, §14-23). Eöl briefly had a history that his skill in metalwork was due to once having been a slave of Morgoth, but that was swiftly changed to having learned it from the Dwarves, as it was too repetitive of Maeglin’s future. (11, §8) The rest of the text of Christopher’s notes about this essay deals with geography, road systems, and travel time calculations, which rely on a map. (11)


Food for Thought

~ Do you think Aredhel and Eöl’s relationship was consensual or based in abuse?

~ Eöl is said to have felt ill at ease in Doriath much like Aredhel tired of Gondolin. Do you find it strange that Eöl then begrudged Aredhel her freedom, considering that he appears to share her unhappiness in confinement?

~ Do you think that Eöl was at least partly right about his thoughts of the Noldor usurping land that once belonged to the Teleri? Do you think that other Sindar thought the same?

~ How many other people wished to leave Gondolin but could not? Was there any resentment over the fact that Aredhel could and did leave due to simply being Turgon’s sister?

~ Similarly, how many people like Eöl would have liked to escape the Girdle of Melian but did not in time manage to?

~ How do you think Gondolin sustained itself in regards to food and supplies?

~ Why do you think Eöl's servants did not try to stop Aredhel and Maeglin when they say they want to visit the sons of Fëanor? After all, Eöl forbade dealing with any “slayers of our kin” and “usurpers of our homes”, not just the Noldor of Gondolin.

~ How do you think things would have turned out if Eöl hadn’t followed Aredhel and Maeglin - or if the javelin hadn't been poisoned?

~ Do you think that Curufin is (partly) to blame for Aredhel's death, first because he sent Eöl in the right direction and second because he humiliated Eöl, further provoking Eöl's hatred of the Noldor?

~ Do you think that Aredhel may secretly have wanted Eöl to follow her, counting on the ruthlessness of Gondolin's guards?

~ Did Celegorm’s people search for Aredhel when she disappeared? If so, why weren’t they successful?

~ Why does Maeglin try to compensate for Idril's lack of love by gaining power? Could Turgon of the BoLT be right about Maeglin's motivations, or do you suspect something more sinister?


Works Cited

(1) The Book of Lost Tales 2. “The Fall of Gondolin”, Notes and Commentary: (vi) Isfin and Eöl.
(2) The Book of Lost Tales 2. “The Fall of Gondolin”.
(3) The Lays of Beleriand. II: Poems Early Abandoned, “The Lay of the Fall of Gondolin”.
(4) The Shaping of Middle-earth. “The Earliest 'Silmarillion', 15 & 16.
(5) The Shaping of Middle-earth. “The Quenta”, 15 & 16.
(6) The Shaping of Middle-earth. “The Earliest Annals of Beleriand”, 171 & 192.
(7) The Lost Road, The Later Annals of Beleriand, 271 and 292
(8) The Lost Road, Quenta Silmarillion, "Of Men and Dwarfs," §124
(9) The War of the Jewels, The Grey Annals, §117-120 and notes
(10) The War of the Jewels, The Grey Annals, §273 and note
(11) The War of the Jewels, Part Three: The Wanderings of Húrin and Other Writings not Forming Part of the Quenta Silmarillion, III: Maeglin


Please note: We don't know everything and it's perfectly possible that we missed something. These summaries and questions are by no means supposed to be complete and exhaustive. If you have looked further into this particular topic or would like to discuss something that we've overlooked, please share it!

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Finally, don't forget to rec your favorite fanworks related to this chapter in the Fanworks Rec Post.

“Of the Coming of Men into the West” is due August 10.

Comments

[tehta.livejournal.com]

1. I can certainly accept abusive interpretations of the marriage, but in my own writing I tend to go with a relationship that went sour, but that was originally based on attraction and many common points of personality. (With a side-serving of Aredhel perhaps not taking it entirely seriously as a permanent arrangement, even after a child was born -- I mean, she's Finwe's grandchild, and her grandfather made multiple marriages work for him... It's not like Eol is going to follow her back to Valinor, anyway.)
2. Hypocrisy is not all that strange, and many of the people who do not want to obey others' rules are only too likely to set them.
3. I am sure some Teleri resented the Noldor, for this or other reasons. Others might have agreed with Maedhros' idea that land is under the stewarship of whoever can protect it, or just dismissed the idea of land-ownership altogether. I mean, come on, who can own a river or a tree? It's just stupid. (<-- they might have said.)
4. I am sure there was some resentment, but I think most people (except for the very young) had gone to Gondolin with a pretty clear picture of what to expect. The better question is why Aredhel changed her mind... Anyway, there were legit ways to leave Gondolin, too, at various points: e.g., as part of a boat-crew, like Voronowe.
5. I thought the Girdle of Melian kept undesirable people out, not its inhabitants in?
6. Depending on how big the Valley and the foothills were, Gondolin may well have been able to grow all its own food (and wood, and cloth-materials, and we know they had ore...) It had tens of thousands of citizens, not millions.
7. I have the feeling that stopping Aredhel and Maeglin would not have been so easy.
8. I could write paragraphs on this AU. Gondolin would still fall, though.
9. I enjoy blaming Curufin for things very much, but in this case I feel the connection is rather tenuous. (Plus, I imagine that even a Kinslayer might find it hard to imagine someone killing a child or a spouse.)
10. No, I really don't think Aredhel was the subtle sneaky type.
11. Those forests were tricky, and good at keeping people out unless an inhabitant wanted them to enter.
12. I quite like that interpretation, but I also like the idea that he sought power because he thought it would impress her. (Many men make this mistake.)

[independence1776]

With a side-serving of Aredhel perhaps not taking it entirely seriously as a permanent arrangement, even after a child was born -- I mean, she's Finwe's grandchild, and her grandfather made multiple marriages work for him... It's not like Eol is going to follow her back to Valinor, anyway.

Ooh, that's an interesting twist! It makes sense to me, too.

I thought the Girdle of Melian kept undesirable people out, not its inhabitants in?

It says in the Silm he fled when the girdle was in place, but in "Maeglin" in WoJ, it says (in a rejected passage) that the girdle couldn't be passed without leave of the king or queen. So it seems as if it was a boundary control measure.

I could write paragraphs on this AU. Gondolin would still fall, though.

I'd like to know more!

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

With a side-serving of Aredhel perhaps not taking it entirely seriously as a permanent arrangement, even after a child was born

Oh, very interesting point!

Hypocrisy is not all that strange

Heh! I was wondering whether this question shouldn't be worded better, but couldn't think of how. Replacing "strange" by "hypocritical" would have been a good start...

I mean, come on, who can own a river or a tree? It's just stupid. (<-- they might have said.)

That's another excellent point! I think I'm going to steal it if I ever write that Haladin anthropology (haha) fic I've been toying with in my head, if I may!

I thought the Girdle of Melian kept undesirable people out, not its inhabitants in?

It's no longer so clear in the Silm, but in earlier drafts, even the Sindar of Doriath couldn't pass through the Girdle without permission. Which makes sense, if Mortals (and possibly even less desirable folk) could make their way through the Girdle if they followed an Elf - you wanted to know who was roaming outside and possibly dragging spies...

Depending on how big the Valley and the foothills were, Gondolin may well have been able to grow all its own food (and wood, and cloth-materials, and we know they had ore...)

Definitely! If their climate was anything like it is in some of the valleys of the Alps, they even may have been able to grow wine. Who knows, maybe in times of peace the House of the Golden Flower was an agricultural corporation? ;) It just isn't ever explained, which is such a pity. (I think we not only need a poster-sized map of Beleriand, we also need a decent economical map! ;))

I imagine that even a Kinslayer might find it hard to imagine someone killing a child or a spouse

Another excellent point. I tend to forget how... innocent they all were, even after the Darkening and Alqualondë.

I really don't think Aredhel was the subtle sneaky type.

Probably not! Although I do see her as vengeful..

[angelica-ramses.livejournal.com]

I'd like to start by saying that Aredhel is my favourite female character so I tend to take her side in all this.

I agree that the relation must have been consensual at the beginning. Maybe Aredhel was pissed at not being able to find Celegorm in Himlad? Then she met this dark, mysterious stranger and boom! What she can't have imagined was that she was exchanging being locked in Gondolin for being locked in Nan Elmoth - not a good deal.

On her leaving Gondolin: I think the big question is why she agreed to go in the first place. To act as mother subsitute to Idril? Tnat's my favourite response so when Idril grew up, it was time to go. I must admit that I've always found the Gondolin concept rather claustrophobic so I can see her point. Other people who went to Gondolin either thought it was a good idea (why leave then?)or were bound to Turgon by oaths of fealty that couldn't be broken.

Curufin's involvement: not direct, though the exchange with Eol is great (as snarky as it gets!). I can't help wondering why Celegorm doesn't seem to try to find her. I'm probabbly taking an over-romanticized view of their relation and by now neither cared about the other!

Maeglin: pity there were no psychologists in Gondolin, he definitely needs therapy!

[independence1776]

That's a very good reason to take her side!

I, too, tend to think it was consensual at first. (How long it took to become abusive is something I haven't decided on, but I tend to think sooner rather than later.) And this "What she can't have imagined was that she was exchanging being locked in Gondolin for being locked in Nan Elmoth - not a good deal." is something I agree completely with.

I can't help wondering why Celegorm doesn't seem to try to find her.

Me, too. There's one mention in one of the later drafts (beats me which) that his people tried to look for her. But why give up? And why not suspect Eöl?

Maeglin: pity there were no psychologists in Gondolin, he definitely needs therapy!

Sometimes I think half the people in the book need it…

[angelica-ramses.livejournal.com]

Sometimes I think half the people in the book need it…

LOL *coughFeanorcough* and Eol!: takes a Noldorin wife to show the Noldor invaders who's really in charge? (I was going to say on top, but wrong metaphor! \0/)

We say here that somebody badly in need of theraphy is (free translation) carne de diván = "couch fodder" (does it make sense?). Well, carne de diván all of them!

[independence1776]

*snickers*

Your translation makes sense; it's close to one of our idioms (which I can't recall off the top of my head at the moment).

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

I think the big question is why she agreed to go in the first place. To act as mother subsitute to Idril?

Interesting idea! Or maybe the idea of disappearing to some secret place nobody else knew about (neener, neener!) appealed to her in the beginning. Then the novelty wore off and she got bored with it...

Maeglin: pity there were no psychologists in Gondolin, he definitely needs therapy!

Definitely! But isn't that often a problem in history (even made-up history) - a lack of therapists? (Námo doesn't count!)

[zopyrus.livejournal.com]

To act as mother subsitute to Idril?

That's my working theory for my own fic, although I think she might have gone for any number of additional reasons, and changed her mind later. (She might have gone for Turgon's sake, too--she argues somewhat colorfully with him in their one canon conversation, but I don't think that necessarily means they had a bad relationship all the time.)

[angelica-ramses.livejournal.com]

I agree that she is attached to Turgon and follows him everywhere, farther and farther, first Nevrast, then Gondolin so they must have gotten along pretty well. But I see her personality more Fingon like so why not stay in Hithlum? Getting away from Daddy? (more need for Elven phsychotherapists here!)

[zopyrus.livejournal.com]

I see her as very similar to Fingon, too! But if they are too similar, perhaps their personalities clashed?

[zopyrus.livejournal.com]

I agree with some commenters above that Aredhel's abuse is not so much a question of "if" as "when"--and I'll add that to me, the phrase "not wholly unwilling" would ring alarm bells in any modern context.

Curufin's role is interesting in light of Tolkien's notes--rather than holding Curufin responsible for Aredhel's death, Tolkien wrote that his meeting with Eol "was good, since it shows Curufin, too often the villain, in a better and more honorable light." He goes on to explain that Curufin totally hated Eol and "greatly wished!" to kill him, but that even Kinslayers draw the line at murdering guests in cold blood.

I don't really think the scene works the way Tolkien wanted it to, though...it doesn't make me hate Curufin, but it DOES make me think he's an idiot. If he knows/believes that Aredhel's marriage was coerced in some way (implied by the "without gift or leave" comment), then surely there is a middle ground between not killing Eol and giving him helpful directions!

[independence1776]

the phrase "not wholly unwilling" would ring alarm bells in any modern context.

When I first read the Silm a decade ago (and being unaware of the earlier version), that phrase didn't bother me; I just thought it meant that she had concerns, likely about not being able to see her family. Now it has big, flashing, neon warning lights attached.

it doesn't make me hate Curufin, but it DOES make me think he's an idiot. If he knows/believes that Aredhel's marriage was coerced in some way (implied by the "without gift or leave" comment), then surely there is a middle ground between not killing Eol and giving him helpful directions!

Yes, exactly!

[zopyrus.livejournal.com]

When I first read the Silm a decade ago (and being unaware of the earlier version), that phrase didn't bother me

Yeah, me too. I'm way more sensitive to this kind of thing now than I used to be. I'm not sure if it's just that I'm older (quite possible) or that discussion of consent issues has become more mainstream in the last decade. Either way, our perspective on this stuff is pretty far removed from the context in which Tolkien was writing.

[independence1776]

Probably both. At least, that's why for me.

Either way, our perspective on this stuff is pretty far removed from the context in which Tolkien was writing.

Yup. And context matters. (So does influence. For example, I once saw someone argue Fëanor's first exile was too harsh a punishment-- but in old Norse culture, which we know Tolkien was inspired by, it was the appropriate one. Trying to map modern morals onto Middle-earth doesn't always work. Not that this excuses Eöl's actions, etc.)

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

I already got in a fight once when somebody insisted that Eöl was totally treated unjustly because after all Aredhel wasn't unwilling. She was not wholly unwilling! That's worlds away!

If he knows/believes that Aredhel's marriage was coerced in some way (implied by the "without gift or leave" comment)

But to be fair, I don't think the "without gift or leave" concerns Aredhel's consent. Rather, it concerns her family. To me, this seems to imply that the Eldar a) required parental permission for marriage (IIRC, this is also mentioned as desirable if not strictly necessary in LaCE!) - that's the "leave" part - and b) that some form of bridewealth was normally in order (Thingol would certainly agree ;)) - that would be the "gift" part. So rather than suggesting that he feels Aredhel's marriage was coerced, Curufin just says that Eöl neither asked her family's permission nor sent them compensation, tsk tsk!

I agree that this scene doesn't quite work the way Tolkien seems to have intended. I see his point, but like you, I think Curufin could have found some other way of being honorable but not helpful. (Unless my conspiracy theory about Aredhel wanting to be followed touches upon the truth after all! ;))

[zopyrus.livejournal.com]

I already got in a fight once when somebody insisted that Eöl was totally treated unjustly because after all Aredhel wasn't unwilling. She was not wholly unwilling! That's worlds away!

People can be awful. :(

But to be fair, I don't think the "without gift or leave" concerns Aredhel's consent. Rather, it concerns her family.

I was wondering if someone would challenge me on that! I think you're absolutely right about the correct interpretation of the line. The value system in this chapter is so uncomfortably...chivalrous. All the men in the story (Turgon, Eol, Curufin) think they deserve to have a say in what happens to Aredhel, and the narrative punishes her every time she steps out of line.

My handwavy reinterpretation of Curufin's line was an attempt to mitigate that somewhat--I think it works as a fic explanation, but less well as a true reading of the text.

(Unless my conspiracy theory about Aredhel wanting to be followed touches upon the truth after all! ;))

I love this theory--it gives her more agency.

[oloriel.livejournal.com]

The value system in this chapter is so uncomfortably...chivalrous. All the men in the story (Turgon, Eol, Curufin) think they deserve to have a say in what happens to Aredhel, and the narrative punishes her every time she steps out of line.

Too true. I feel as uncomfortable with that as with the idea (from BoLT rather than the final text) that it was Turgon's, not Idril's say that would ultimately have mattered: Idril clearly did not want to marry Maeglin, yet Maeglin went and asked Turgon anyway (presumably hoping that Turgon would overrule his daughter)? Argh!

I love this theory--it gives her more agency.

It's full of loopholes, but yes, precisely - it no longer makes her someone who foolishly runs away from her "protectors", runs into a stranger who forces her to abide by his rules, and then runs away from him but is too vain to wear sensible clothing! >_>

[anna-wing.livejournal.com]

This always looked to me like one of those marriages between fundamentally incompatible people that just happened out of excitement, love of novelty and general bad judgement. And then more bad judgement and a hefty dose of bad luck just led to disaster.

On that "by gift or leave" thing, Aredhel is royal and the marriages of royalty are not merely their own personal concern, certainly not in Middle-earth where unlike Valinor issues of succession were a real and pressing worry (one never hears about any of the Vanyar or the Teleri stressing about who is going to succeed Olwe and Ingwe, and their spouses). So a Princess of the Noldor trotting off and marrying some unknown chap in the middle of nowhere (who then turns out to have a reputation for being both hostile to the Noldor and Seriously Strange) would actually be a legitimate concern to the rest of the family.

I did not think that she was 'abused' in the modern Western sense, since she is herself Calaquendi, powerful and self-assured. I think of it as her indulging what she thinks of as Eol's eccentricities for a while, and then getting tired of them. When it turns out that they are a lot more than just harmless oddity, she gets alarmed at his erratic behaviour and leaves, taking Maeglin with her.

Incidentally, and imprisoning your children does seem to be a Sindarin thing - Eol threatened to do it to Maeglin and Thingol actually did it to Luthien; perhaps because of fear of the real dangers of Beleriand?

As for wanting to leave Gondolin, I always assumed that Aredhel just could not get used to the idea that unlike Valinor it was genuinely unsafe to go wandering around in Middle-earth on your own. She went because it sounded like fun and then she got bored. She definitely does not seem to have inherited the good-and-conscientious-administrators bit of the House of Finwe's heritage.

[independence1776]

On that "by gift or leave" thing, Aredhel is royal and the marriages of royalty are not merely their own personal concern, certainly not in Middle-earth where unlike Valinor issues of succession were a real and pressing worry

But even non-royal couples in the real world have, in times past and in some places now, needed permission from their family to marry. It's not simply a royal line of succession issue. (If you go by LACE, permission isn't required but it is the polite thing to do.)

[anna-wing.livejournal.com]

Yes, I agree. In quite a lot of places one would still generally be expected to at least make an effort not to marry to disoblige one's family.

[hhimring]

I can quite see why in a headcanon or fanfic context one would want Aredhel and Eol's relationship to be one that was originally consensual and then went sour. I have to say I can't see that in the actual text. Yes, Tolkien took out the actual rape, but he left in the trickery and entrapment. Aredhel would surely have noticed she was trapped quite soon, if not immediately, and it seems unlikely that she would not have worked out that she had been intentionally entrapped in the first place.
If she was "not wholly unwilling", it means to me she was never entirely willing either and conflicted from the first.

Similarly, while my personal headcanon is that Aredhel went to Gondolin chiefly for Idril's sake, the Legendarium texts suggest to me that she was not seen to actually have a choice. Unlike Galadriel, she does not herself decide to go to Middle-earth in HoME, she is entrusted to Turgon and Elenwe (by Fingolfin?) and probably stays entrusted to him. (sorry, cannot supply reference right now). She seems to have inherited a certain amount of lack of agency from Isfin, despite the apparent change of character.

She is said to have loved Turgon and Elenwe, though...

[independence1776]

Interpretations of the text vary from person to person and there's no reconciling them. There are some things I can't see, some things I can. And Idril realizing she's trapped is what tips it over into abusive for me, because I have no doubt she tried to leave to visit Celegorm shortly after her marriage and when she couldn't, things got worse.

I honestly have no opinion on why she went to Gondolin, but it does appear that there wasn't much choice involved for any of Turgon's followers. It seems strange to me that no one chose to stay behind and pledge themselves to another lord and fight rather than hide. But maybe that wasn't a possibility.